They won’t be the only ones: The diesel cars were programmed to sense when emissions were being tested and to turn on equipment that reduced emissions, according to United States officials. At other times, the cars had better fuel economy and performance, but produced as much as 40 times the allowed amount of nitrogen oxide, a pollutant that can contribute to respiratory problems including asthma, bronchitis and emphysema.
From the comments:
I have an experience working with a company trying to make a new wood stove that meets the new draconian EPA particulate requirements. In order to pass the testing and certify the stove they had to create a specific method to stack the wood, pre burn a nice warm coal bed, etc so that they could get a clean burn for the test. The test is also done with 4×4’s and 2×4’s, not irregular pieces of wood. They passed by ensuring that there was no chance that a piece of wood could shift to the front of the stove instead of straight down. Any wood shifting to the front would result in over 1000% increase in particulate. Impossible to actually meet the requirements under any real world condition.
Volkswagen were just trying to please – low NOx emissions for the greenies, good fuel economy for sensible customers. That shouldn’t be held against them!
They’ll be forced to take on “migrants” as employees as penance for this.
Perhaps Obama and crew have actually legislated a scientific impossibility. Maybe everyone realized this and simply cheated. At some point they might want to consider pollution control as achieved. The cost of getting rid of the tiny fraction of pollutants remaining compared to the 1960s may very well be beyond reasonable.
I can understand the respiratory issues if one lives in a big city core with thousands of VW diesels buzzing around but is that the case?…Thousands of VW concentrated in the same area I mean. There are far more transport trucks burning diesel in Toronto everyday than VW’s. How are the emissions of these big buggers? Far worst per liter burned I am sure. But transport trucks are a “necessary evil”, right? NOT! Trucks are all over our roads since the advent of “just in time” inventories. In older times, trains had the bulk of transport. Where were the outcries for respiratory issues when trucks invaded the roads with their dirty stacks?
Wasn’t the tougher regulations directed mostly at Global warming (Now climate change) for passenger car emissions in the last 20 years or so?
Where I’m getting at is this: Although not excusing VW to be cheats were it was unfair competition again’st other honest car manufacturers, I still think it is almost a case of “Atlas Shrug” because it is based mainly on the lie that is GW/CC.
With all the Governments and other class action suits pending from a bunch of vultures that will cry “Poor Mother Gaia”all see right now is a huge Company employing thousands of people that might be killed mostly based on a lie that profits anti capitalist vultures including Goverments like the Ontario’s Wynne regime.
ATLAS SHRUG ALREADY!
Diesel engine vehicles are naturally fuel efficient and with a good turbo they are fairly clean as well -a good deal for the tourqe they put out for the fuel cost. Bloody cold hearted buxxxers to start in -40 though
Scar has the right idea. You can clean up a lot of emissions fairly cheaply, but the marginal cost of cleaning up the last fraction keeps rising.
Also consider that the diesel emission regs impact rather unfairly on VW, since VW is basically the only manufacturer to even offer a diesel-powered car in the American market. Other makers don’t even try.
I have an experience working with a company trying to make a new wood stove that meets the new draconian EPA particulate requirements. In order to pass the testing and certify the stove they had to create a specific method to stack the wood, pre burn a nice warm coal bed, etc so that they could get a clean burn for the test. The test is also done with 4×4’s and 2×4’s, not irregular pieces of wood. They passed by ensuring that there was no chance that a piece of wood could shift to the front of the stove instead of straight down. Any wood shifting to the front would result in over 1000% increase in particulate. Impossible to actually meet the requirements under any real world condition.
How about a car tht runs entirly on Hot Air it would be great for Al Gore and the rest of the eco-freaks in hollywood or else where
Ummm…wouldn’t better fuel economy ultimately reduce overall emissions though?
How they were caught:
http://blog.caranddriver.com/how-volkswagen-got-busted-for-gaming-epa-diesel-emissions-standards/
“Somewhat ironically, the presumed benefits of turning off the controls for normal driving include improved fuel economy and engine power.”
Why do rural / less populated regions have to cater to the demands of a few that live in large cities? NOx is beneficial to agriculture and forests. Why not let us have fuel efficient vehicles and let the cities legislate their own emission standards?
I am up to my neck in schadenfreude with this VW thingy.
Here’s why.
Back in 1981 I had 1979 VW Rabbit. That model year had a problem with valve adjustment slippage and valves would burn out … Top end rework was required on the engine. VW in Edmonton said they couldn’t do for a month … it was still under warranty. i need my car to go to work so I brought it to an after market VW service place Lavarado Motors. They did a beautiful job within three days and I paid them 650 bucks. They I tried to get reimbursed from VW and they told be to stuff it … if I couldn’t wait the month then I had to pay.
I decided right then that I would never own another VW product, nor would anyone I had any influence over and there are many. I believe I cost VW tens of thousands in lost sales and service over the past 35 years. I had owned two other VWs before the Rabbit and may well have continued on with them. But they were greedy and stupid.
I know that I mean nothing to them, but I as I stated, I am up to my neck in schadenfreude over their loss of what will be billions for being greedy and stupid. Now buy Japanese vehicles exclusively and so does everyone I know. Euro-weenies can stuff everything and enjoy their new muslim hordes.
Would it not be somewhat simpler and cheaper to just completely ban diesel
powered cars from LA and let the rest of the country go on about its business?
While they are at it they could also ban electricity that doesn’t meet their
“necessary” high standards.
Everyone wins.
“Ummm…wouldn’t better fuel economy ultimately reduce overall emissions though?”
There you go again, Mr. Blackbeard. Talking common dog f**k sense. That has absolutely no bearing on the socialist/commie agenda. Get with the pogro…err…program!
DEF on the EPA!
“Volkswagen is working intensely to eliminate these deviations through technical measures,” the company said.
Put the CEO in jail. Deviation eliminated.
Someone pointed out that VW is following the law as written. The emission controls work “when being tested” just as required by the regulations as they are written. The computers are programmed to recognize the highly scripted and contrived test conditions and maximize the emmissions controls, and that affects performance and mileage. Emission controls are just turned down when the car is operated in the real world, allowing better mileage and performance.
Want to bet that their programmers read the “rules” and gamed the regulations? Just like they do when trying to find every advantage while playing a game? Note they did not turn off the emmission controls entirely, they just turned them down to make the car perform better.
“Ummm…wouldn’t better fuel economy ultimately reduce overall emissions though?”
There you go again, Mr. Blackbeard. Talking common dog f**k sense. That has absolutely no bearing on the socialist/commie agenda. Get with the pogro…err…program!
———————–
A 15% improvement in fuel economy and a 40% increase in NOx means a net of (1-0.15) x 40% or 34% overall increase in NOx. So no reduction in emissions unless fuel economy is increased by 40%.
These vehicles likely wouldn’t have met emissions standards without cheating.
NOx is a precursor for tropospheric ozone. Why does the EPA hate the ozone layer?
As a Jetta diesel owner, I know that I get at the very least – 55 miles to the gallon. Consistently! This far exceeds what a friend gets with his ‘half-gassed’ nissan that shuts off going downhill. He has quit commenting on gas mileage when we get together.
I recently asked a family member, a volunteer fire fighter, how they handle the battery issues when one of these ‘environmentally-friendly’ things is involved in a serious rear-end collision. No answer.
“I recently asked a family member, a volunteer fire fighter, how they handle the battery issues when one of these ‘environmentally-friendly’ things is involved in a serious rear-end collision. No answer.”
CO2. And lots of it. Freezes and stops the run-away the battery is producing. Or if you are big fire department, and have the units, liquid nitrogen.
From another commenter,
penalties of up to $18 billion. (for VW)
124 dead, who knows how many injured, because of GM ignition defect and they escape with a fine of $0.9 billion.
another HotAir commenter;
Can the vehicles pass. Yes.
This is about killing the diesel vehicle, which the California Air Resources Board has been wanting to do for several years, even ginning up false data in an effort to stop the use of diesel. It’s quite ok for CARB and the EPA to cheat, lie, steal and even grossly pollute, because the ends justifies the means.
Neitherleftorright on September 20, 2015 at 11:21 AM
Interesting comparison – guess the big penalty is for VW as they were doing wrong against “Gaia”, the most precious thing EPA has to safueguard (apart of polluting rivers), but the 0,9 bn against GM is just people being hurt.
Second interesting point, although obviously cheating, could it be that the software engineers following the instructions to exactly by operating in test mode for the check, then going back to normal operation. Wouldn’t surprise me.
Hitler Reacts To The VW-EPA Scandal Dieselgate
When I read this story I laughed and laughed. It was only a matter of time before someone came up with a virtual method of meeting these imaginary goals. If we could only get them working on meeting climate change targets.It would only be fairs ncethe same techniques are being used to justify the targets.
I await the eviro-freak hysteric media to assert that VW is ‘gassing the planet’…
Disclaimer: I own and drive a 1991 Jetta with 425,000 kms, HAPPILY.
Isn’t the Obama-Nation™ disbanding the EPA for their over the top über regulation?
Cheers
Hans Rupprecht, Commander in Chief
1st Saint Nicolaas Army
Army Group ‘True North’
You have to admit;
It is funny that VW Farfukgnugened the Greenie Weenies, Obama,
and EPA for all these years.
55 miles per gallon and no emissions- ha.
They should sell that emissions cheating software to the Chinese for billions..
So, I will do anyone a favour, if they are feeling particularly guilty and self-loathing, owning and driving a faux “pollution free” diesel Veedub.
I’ll throw 1 or 2 large your way for your late model smog machine….just sayin…..and take it off your hands, do ya a favour……watch the dumping begin in the used market.
There will be deals, the slef-loathing is pervasive in our society….when 60% of our electorate appears to be voting for the self-loathing eco-hypocrites of the Fibs and Dips.
For the fist time in decades I am inclined to lease a VW product, would never buy one because of quality issues, but leasing one for a few years as a second car just became much more appealing. Good for VW. They are heroes here not villains. Pity they got caught, but bargains are coming to the VW Audi dealership near you.
Exactly what do you want to put the CEO in jail for? For delivering better cars to consumers? It is the EPA that belongs behind bars.
“Ummm…wouldn’t better fuel economy ultimately reduce overall emissions though?”
No it is exactly the opposite. The most efficient engines are the ones most polluting. By forcing the engine not to pollute most of the energy in fuel is wasted. That is why the mass transit worshiping governments are constantly tightening the pollution and efficiency rules. They know full well that these rules work against one another. In order to comply with both sets of rules cars are weaker, smaller, more complex and harder and more expensive than ever. All part of the same equation. All aimed at gradual elimination of private transportation.
^ meant to say harder to repair
You might have had more impact on VW Edmonton by going back to them to shop for Volkswagen cars, test driving, etc. but actually buying them from another dealer. And telling them about it.
Good for you. Hope someone from VW reads this. And other places too that need to offer responsible customer service.
Other makers don’t even try.
That will come as a bit of a rude shock to the owners of BMW 3series, 5 series, and X series turbo diesels.
I do not care what the volkswagen puts out. there is something far more toxic coming from all level of government.
I called a client of mine who owns several car dealerships. I have her on the lookout for a nice, slightly used VW Touareg Diesel. I’ve wanted one for a while, and this looks like the perfect time to buy one.
The VW diesels in Europe do not have to meet this ridiculous emissions standard and Europe is not covered in particulate matter like Beijing, despite most of the cars there having diesel engines.
The USA used to ban all diesel cars, to protect the United Autoworkers Union in Detroit.